Thursday, June 05, 2014

It's really not about the guy...

On the latest right wing attempt to find a reason to impeach Obama, he, like Clinton earlier, seems eager to help them. It wasn't that he made a mistake with Bergdorf. I'll discuss that more below but read this first.


From what I understand of the rules of war. When the war is over, the enemy combatants must be released. POW are prisoners of war. Unless these men have been relabeled as terrorists, they were soldiers. Now if some in Gitmo are actually terrorists, that might be dealt with otherwise, but the ones I read about sounded like military leaders of the Taliban. Yes, we don't like them. We also didn't like the Japanese or Vietnamese while we were fighting them but did we keep their soldiers and leaders prisoners after the wars ended?

Are we wanting to abide by the rules of civilized warfare, or do we have a right wing element who only want to condemn Obama whatever he does? Are Americans that easily led that they will fall into whatever the latest jingoism says by someone like Lindsey Graham who is about as disgusting as a leader as any I can imagine.

If the right gets the Senate, look for impeachment and Obama seems eager to help them do it. He did the right thing by the trade. Say what you want but the way I read it, rescue by force in Pakistan given the situation was not possible. Leaving behind the guy who may have become unhinged was also not acceptable. The trade-off was of those who should be released when we quit fighting there.

BUT I don't think highly of what Obama did with a Rose Garden show to try and get political hay from this whole thing. I think that was totally stupid. He knew the guy's disappearance had been suspect as to what was going on; but if you read the above article, why don't we all wait and see what's been going on. He tried to escape twice from the Taliban. We should just wait and see-- while we recognize that war breaks many people even those who think they could handle it. 

The ones who are condemning this are the ones who have blocked more spending for the veterans. They are on both sides of every issue depending on what they think they can use. Most of all it's about whatever they can use to go after the unacceptable Democratic, black President.

19 comments:

Ingineer66 said...

I am surprised that you called this a racial issue. This has nothing to do with race. It is not even a Democrat vs Republican issue. It is about the military which is not split into political parties. And it is about whether the President violated two laws. Democrats in Congress and even Chris Mathews has questions and concerns over the President's actions.

Ingineer66 said...

And they were not just POWs released from Gitmo. At least one is wanted by the World Court in The Hague for mass murder. President consensus sure didn't get consensus on this one.

Rain Trueax said...

Chris Matthews goes nuts on things regularly; so he's not one to rely on to be unemotional. The guys didn't get totally released. They were sent to Qatar. If the world court wants him, good they get him, better than the US holding him down there. Gitmo is a disaster as an idea, impossible to shut down but it should be. Charge them or let them go. The problem is even if someone wasn't a terrorist before they got there, they would be when they leave out of resentment for the unfair treatment.

And when you see something like Missouri recently where someone hung a mannequin from a bridge with an Obama mask, when you hear the disrespect, the monkey jokes, etc., when you see signs saying he didn't get elected, that it's not their government, you tell me when it's been that bad before. There are some who cannot stand the idea of a black family representing our country. Explain how they attacked Michelle over wanting healthy eating and encouraging kids to exercise. What First Lady ever got attacked for working on something that out to be noncontroversial!

And the notification of Congress was what Congress set up, not a law as such in the land. He is Commander in Chief. He has the right to use discretion when he feels he must. Obviously if it had gone to Congress, they'd have aired it publicly, made hay out of it whatever they would have wanted if it'd been Bush, and the deal would have fallen through.

Dems are down on him over the carbon reduction also in coal. They are afraid they will lose more seats and this is just one more to be afraid is a bad issue. It's not like they are so noble as to only care what is right.

The point is he was a soldier, who evidently was wandering off before the time he got captured. Sounds like he wasn't someone that should have stayed in the military, maybe something not right mentally, and should have been sent stateside only wasn't. He tried to escape twice; so he wasn't willing to be where he was. They could not get him out with violence because of how he was being held. More would have died that way.

Obama has killed many of their top leaders with drones. You seriously going to tell me he won't kill any of these guys who become terrorist leaders? I think we had way too many soldiers in Gitmo and that's not how it works that they are held after the war ends. Or do we no longer follow any civilized protocols?

And on Chris Matthews. I never watch him. He drives me nuts with histrionics even when he's on the side of what I consider correct!

Rain Trueax said...

another article worth reading dishonorable discharge.. All the more reason to not jump to conclusion on the trade. The last I read they said that the Taliban would have killed Bergdahl if the deal had leaked and with Congress as they are, who seriously believes they would not have deliberately leaked it in 30 days!

Ingineer66 said...

He was not drafted in to the Army so why did he volunteer during a war if he didn't want to fight? It reminds me of the guy in Seven Years in Tibet. That guy deserted the German Army and his family and we made a movie about his adventure. But he was just a slacker that didn't want to live up to his responsibility.

And it is the law of the land, passed by Congress and signed by the President. But this President likes to pick and choose which laws he is going to follow.

Ingineer66 said...

Hopefully we planted a tracking chip in these guys and a few months from now, we read a story about how 3 of them are killed in a drone strike.

Ingineer66 said...

You have a short memory. Nancy Reagan was ridiculed by the left for her anti-drug campaign. And the wackos on the left even ridiculed Laura Bush for her literacy campaign and she used to be a librarian. So she had experience dealing with the topic.
Based on her own words, Michelle's experience on nutrition appears to be that she like to eat all the foods that she tells other people not to eat.

Rain Trueax said...

Michelle is not fat. She's got a very lush figure which i realize some only admire skinny women but she is just right. I saw a very skinny old woman this morning in the veterinarian's office and she was stooped over with osteoporosis. Skinny isn't always better. And what lefties ridiculed Laura Bush? I only heard good things about her from any of my liberal friends. She was the best thing about George. She was a trained librarian as i recall so give me a break people admired her for the literacy campain. You sure it wasn't righties who ridiculed her. I wonder if you are believing what you were told, not what was said. Laura was respected on a lot of levels.

Did you read the article at the top of this piece? He isn't the only one who volunteered and didn't realize what war would be like. He got into a far outpost which definitely put him under greater risk than some of our soldiers in Afghanistan. I think a lot volunteer with no idea what it means to be in a war. He also indicated it got to him what our soldiers had sometimes done to civilians with no caring. I think a lot of Americans have concerns like that.

Nobody though has proven he tried to desert just because he was absent without leave. The guy who accused him turns out to have had a less than honorable discharge; so watch who you listen to on this. You really want to be on Lindsey Graham's side on any issue? Even the right wing guys ridicule him on radio. lol

Ingineer66 said...

That is good that we agree about Laura Bush. But I read a wide range of sources and there were left-wing sites that were very negative about her.

I did not say that Michelle is fat or make any other comments about her appearance. I said from her own words. She talks about how she likes to eat french fries and other types of food that she doesn't want us little people to have access to.

I want to hear from Sgt. Bergdahl about what he did and what he intended to do. He needs a court martial and then hopefully the facts will come out. He is delusional or a collaborator or just about anything in between. No matter what he is, he is not somebody that the White House should have been holding up as a hero while trying to spike the football in the Rose Garden with his parents. And now they are saying that was just a coincidence that his parents were in DC on the day he was released. I am curious if they made a habit out of traveling to DC. If they were there all the time I might sort of believe that, but if they did not ever leave Idaho, then I really don't believe that story. And why has the White House changed the reason 3 times already for no time to tell Congress?

Rain Trueax said...

Likely because he hated to say to supposed leaders that they would have revealed the plan, caused it to fall apart, and Bergdahl would have ended up dead which is what the Taliban said they would do if the plan leaked. Seriously, you believe those republicans or dems would have kept quiet about it for 30 days???. Whatever way Obama did this, they'd have been down on him as it's what they do.

We agree the Rose Garden was stupid at the least. He had to know the backstory on Berkdahl; so even if he felt it was important to get him out of there instead of a taped beheading like they did with the reporter in Pakistan, he should not have given himself a pat on the back just yet. I can believe they might've been there since they were constantly lobbying, and those in the hometown of Hailey to get him back.

With Laura Bush, I liked how she did her own thing, didn't say she believed the same as George on everything and tried to keep him in line for his ego-- which wasn't a small thing. She also did her own trips like Grand Canyon rafting with her women friends. She's a lady and it shows. But so is Michelle.

And Michelle isn't saying don't eat any french fries. She's saying they aren't healthy (grease, fat, salt-- duh) and if kids are already overweight, it's not a good choice. I saw nowhere she suggested banning them. We can like things, indulge once in awhile and still know they aren't a good food for a kid to have in a cafeteria lunch when so many are overweight already. Those overweight kids will be tomorrow's diabetics. Going after us all to eat more sensibly makes sense to anybody who doesn't hate her for just being who she is.

Ingineer66 said...

This administration is in such a hurry to take credit for things. I can't believe they either didn't research the Bergdahl situation better or didn't care. Five and a half years in and it is still amatuer hour at the White House.

Similar to the President making a secret trip to Afghanistan for Memorial Day. They were in such a hurry to take credit for it they emailed out a list of who the President met with to 6,000 people and included the name and title of the top spy in Afghanistan. And when the Washington Post told them they made a mistake the aide argued with him. Finally a senior official figured it out, but it was too late. Scooter Libby served time in jail for outing Valerie Plame an inactive CIA employee that everyone inside the Beltway knew worked for the CIA. The Obama administration outs the station chief in Kabul and it is just another gaffe. Nothing to see here, no investigation needed.

Rain Trueax said...

Presidents do a lot of things including lie us into wars and use torture. They do get away with it because of who they are.

Here's a Vets rant about the way Republicans have thrown Bergdahl under the bus-- worth reading: lowlife Republicans who don't understand what being an American means or should mean. The issue here in the end is did Obama do the right thing in getting Bergdahl. Many Tea Party types have said he didn't. This Vet disagrees and makes his case admirably. Yeah, he's mad.

Ingineer66 said...

If he can release 4 Taliban leaders from Gitmo for one AWOL American why can't he lift a finger to get the Marine being held in Mexico for taking a wrong turn.

Rain Trueax said...

My bet is they are negotiating for that as they were for the Christian woman who was going to be hung in Sudan. A lot of this happens subtly and we sure would not want to say a lot that would interfere with that. The Mexican authorities on the border are... in my opinion, borderline corrupt or they get killed. So this is more like dealing with a bunch of outlaws than a legitimate arrest. They've done it to other Americans to get payoffs. I wouldn't go to Mexico on a bet right now. I made my last walk into Nogales some years back, felt it was very intimidating and don't go now. Things have changed on the Mexican side of the border and it's a lot because of the drug cartels

Ingineer66 said...

You are right on that. I would never go to the border areas and I am not even that interested in going further south. Many Americans were selling out last time I was in Puerto Vallarta.

Ingineer66 said...

This story keeps getting stranger. I heard yesterday that the parents were in a video conference call with the White House, Pentagon and an Afghanistan command center. They had time to set this up but not tell the chairs of the Senate and House oversight committees? You know the people that get daily intelligence briefings.
And on the news this morning they said that 90 people in the Administration knew about the swap plans, but no one in Congress.

Rain Trueax said...

Congress had been alerted a long time earlier that they would do this if they could and which were in the trade. They lie. And the last I read they only had a few hours notice that it was going through. I know you only believe right wing rhetoric but I suggest it's wise to wait on this one. It's not all there yet!

Ingineer66 said...

Dianne Feinstein is not known for her Right Wing Rhetoric.

Rain Trueax said...

Yeah, well she's your senator, not mine. I don't like her. And she often comes on the side of power for her bunch! -- a bunch who right now seem unable to do anything except say no about most of the programs this country might need... oh wait, they say yes to war.